Curse

PtiteDiablesse · Feb 21, 2006, 06:39 PM // 18:39

Oh my god, you people *do* exist! I have found others like me: the spelling- and grammar-conscious!

I'm also pretty sick of the pseudo-English (and even calling it that is rather generous on my part) getting tossed around. It's not so difficult to type in a somewhat coherent and literate manner. It's not so difficult to realize that not too many languages use numbers to spell, so when you do so it just looks stupid.

And there is no excuse, really, for using it. Timesaver? Bull. It saves you, what, a tenth of a second to type 'u' rather than 'you'? Or is it that your fingers get tired really really easily? Second language? So what? Usually second language learning makes a point of emphasizing grammar and spelling. I'm not saying ESL players have to be school-marm-correct... but one presumes that part of the ESL teaching involves... oh, I dunno, English? I manage to type in French somewhat coherently (some of my grammar and conjugations are a little rusty) but at least I'm able to communicate intelligently in another language. I don't see the problem here.

Cherno · Feb 21, 2006, 06:53 PM // 18:53

Sorry, I don't buy your contention that those who are calling those who make extreme mistakes are being snobbish towards the lower class.

You class level cannot be generalized to education. As well if they are really very lower class, there are factors that would contradict it. They are on the internet, they can play the game, they have some sort of computer access.

Also there are tell tale signs of lower eduction, or "class" if you want to call it, in speech and writing habits. All the 1337 speak is not indicitive of that. That kind of speak shows a deliberate attempt to write that way, or laziness to try and communicate in a way that would be accessible to the most midlevel of speakers.

Remember these are international boards and games, and 1337 is not the international computer language. I am not saying that English is, but imagine how hard it is for the people on these boards and in game with limited English to understand what is being said sometimes.

Just because people want to teach, and yes sometimes complain, does not make them "snobbish."

The point above all else is to make your message coherent. That's why the forum rules are there. It doesn't dictacte that you be perfect, no one expects that, but people should put a little effort in if they want reasonable responses.

I know that I for one will start to read a thread started in such a manner and just give up. So have I helped that person? Nope. Could I have? Probably, but not worth the effort to decipher their crap.

Rayea · Feb 21, 2006, 09:29 PM // 21:29

most of those points are true, cherno, except for the point of they cant be *that* poor, they are using the internet, playing the game, thus have a PC

i build then every day for people that are on the dole...*ahem* those on state benefits.
they simply purchace through a lay away or christmas club type, or wait till they get their largest check.
most of these systems are bog standard..a sempron, 256 mem and a 80gig hard drive..but of course they *always* have a dvd-rw....i mean, there has to be some way to make your cash back for spending 300 to 500 on a PC, right?

also to be honest, its not necisarily snobbery that makes some of us act or say the things we do.
i had no fancy education, hell, i had to go *back* to school to get qualifications after leaving my school at 16....because i learend NOTHING of quality from my school, other than that i will spend the rest of my natural life being insulted by people that given a red-headed person, can only come one with the insult of...'GINGER!'....*shakes head*

while some countries do have a problem where they have folks who *want* education, but cannot get hold of it....
we here in the uk are facing the assault of the...i can only call it Bergeron Factor....the willingness to become totally *average*, simply because it is deemed normal and, well...ordinary.

(stemming from a film by the name harrison bergeron, where the population are artificialy *dummed down* to make them all happy little Averages. anyone that cannot fit in and are too inteligent are ether drafted into the mass media and forbiden to have kids, or else lobotomised to make them productive little drones. the main charater, the young mr Bergeron, is too bright, constantly needing trip to the doctors to up his Limiter to make him more average like everyone else.....)

while i can understand the fact that some of us sound snobby to those that like and feel comfortable using the net-speak and text-speak language, i asure you, its not.

i often use text speak.....i just use it when i am textmessaging.

vinegrower · Feb 21, 2006, 09:34 PM // 21:34

One of the problems you will face when trying to enforce English on the american servers is that it covers several languages. Don't forget about the large spanish speaking world, French speaking Canadians, or even the Protugees (sorry for the bad spelling) speaking Brazilians.

drowningfish999 · Feb 21, 2006, 09:35 PM // 21:35

http://www.microsoft.com/athome/secu...n/kidtalk.mspx

Rayea · Feb 21, 2006, 10:12 PM // 22:12

true, but i think more people are worrying about the bad enlish used forum side than game side....

if someone asks you....'whr u get tht nt swrd m8?' in game you ether know..

he actually asked you..'where you get that neat sword mate?'
or that since he is using such text-talk, he is probalby not someone you want to answer.

i have found that, barring the Leet on newbie island of Anrachy Online, i do not want to talk to players or npc types in games that use such language....

(although, if you hapen to have leet and text talk as a bugbear, download Anrachy Online and grab a froob (free) account and take your frustrations out on those Beach Leet, Beach Reet and other Reet and Leet monsters....i will tell you, its satisfying to kill them, then hear them whine....'I GET MY MAIN'.....'PEE-KHAY'.....'FREE STF PLS'....and my personal fave....'WYH DID U LOOT ME?'

Manic Smile · Feb 21, 2006, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by lg5000

Yeah, but the players who come from non-english-speaking countries try to get their english right, and even though the sentence structure is sometimes bad, most words are spellt correctly.

btw, Fiji's national language is English, they have no excuse, unless of course, that means that we don't mind Canadians mis-spelling things cause they're from french canada and people from NZ mis-spelling things cause they are a dual-language country as well.

Oh yeah, and I claim ESL!

Dude...how would you like it if I came to your home beat you up, raped your wife and kids, took your house, took your car, burned your job and told you can't be whatever religion you were and you have to speak some foreign language. Stuff your conceptions on what language Fiji is supposed to speak. Being Hawaiian I know first hand the duality of what American/European society expects vs what they are doing to acutally achieve anything beneficial in that manner. That's not to say no Figian can speak English but I'm willing to bet over half speak it poorly/incorrectly.

Eet GnomeSmasher · Feb 21, 2006, 10:37 PM // 22:37

I see some of you are defensive about your grammar/spelling/typing skills being bashed...but I don't see that any of you so far are that bad at all.

I dont mind SOME short hand but when I get a message like this, "IDK WTF u talkn bout" I can barely translate. I didnt even know what "IDK" stood for until later. Or even worse "Iunno" Sorry but typing that, you sound like a prebuscent valley girl talking.

I'm not a grammar snob at all, as I said before, English is my second language. But seeing people butcher the language on purpose is just lame. And yet these same people go around telling foreign people to learn english? Funny stuff.

Stormfall · Feb 21, 2006, 10:50 PM // 22:50

In my own experience, internet shorthand isn't really so short - mostly because my education beginning around grade 6 required me to first learn proper typing skills until my first year of high school, and second, to apply these skills to my assignments throughout. By now, it's gotten to the point where proper typing comes naturally to me, and far more easily than shorthand. I think if schools concentrated more on basic communication through text, this would be far less an issue. This is reinforced by the education of ESL students, previously mentioned in this discussion - the most significant abuses of English that I've observed are almost never precipitated by people who are not native speakers of the language. Unfortunately, we still live in a world where students can graduate from high school without ever learning to read.

I don't sweat it if a post on a message board displays less than perfect spelling or grammar, since they're mostly decipherable regardless. People are free to type however they will, so it's not really a bother to me. The only issue I have with it is in a setting like Guild Wars, where rapid communication (previously defined in this thread as one party expressing something, and a second party understanding what is being expressed) is necessary. I tend to read words in a way that the conventions of the language tell me is correct: Y-O-U A-R-E is "you are", but U R (as in, "use ur heling monk") is "uhr" or "oor". Naturally, I have to go back and read it again since "uhr" and "oor" are not words, which wastes time where I could be making use of myself to the party.

KvanCetre · Feb 21, 2006, 11:01 PM // 23:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiery

Man you can vent about the grammer usage. Everyone sounds like they have a english major or something. Unlike some, i hve a PhD.

Based on your avatar, of a teenager taking his own picture, I concluded you to be a liar. It didn't seem like you were "just joking" when you wrote this, so I decided to double check...

Your info:
Date of Birth:
December 13, 1989
Age:
16

hmmmmm

Then I examined your first sentence

"grammer" "a english major" "i have"

hmmmmm

Was this supposed to be a serious post?

Eet GnomeSmasher · Feb 22, 2006, 12:16 AM // 00:16

Based on Fiery's past posts, I think he was being serious and not joking. Unless his whole posting personality is a joke.

unienaule · Feb 22, 2006, 12:22 AM // 00:22

Way to go guys! Just about everyone in here who accused other people of flaming then went on to flame somebody else!
...
Closed.